Wednesday, October 3, 2007

October 3, 2007







“1.2? 1.2?! REALLY?” No, not really. That 1.2 is the raw HouseHold number that doesn’t include our DVR performance. We used to receive this raw number early Monday and then wait around for the same-day DVR data to come in and bump that number up a couple of points. I thought it would be irresponsible of me to release the raw number because we have yet to factor in the 3-day DVR audience and didn’t want people flying off the handle. So to all concerned fans (and gleeful haters), that number will go up before week’s end. And THAT end-of-week number will be our official rating.

“But even if the show does a 1.4-1.5, that’s still a big drop from the 2.0’s you guys used to pull in!” True, but t.v. is changing in a big way. DVR penetration has reached 20% of households. The internet now offers viewers the convenience of watching their favorite shows on demand. With the proliferation of channels, t.v.-watchers have more choice than ever before and audiences are becoming more and more fragmented. These are all reasons not just Stargate, but SciFi, cable, and the networks have been bleeding audiences. It’s no coincidence that the inroads made by online entertainment options (ie. I-Tunes) and DVR/Tivo just happen to coincide with the drop in ratings across the board.

“So what does this mean for t.v.?” Well, what this means is that The Powers That Be are going to have to adjust the way they gather and weigh ratings . And they have started. For the first time, programs recorded and watched within 3 days of a show’s initial airing are being factored into the mix. It’s a first step but, clearly, only a baby one in the reconsideration of a dated approach to calculating ratings. Bottom line: they must find a way to calculate a ratings in a way that reflects today’s rapidly developing technologies and increasingly disperse audience.

“So what to do?“ In the words of one of my mother’s bellicose companions: “Get with the program, grandma!” The internet aint a fad. More and more people are going to make use of devices like digital video recorders because it allows them to watch what they want, when they want. Reconcile your expectations with the new reality. I’m reminded of an exchange way back in season 7 when we pulled in a 2.0, the show’s highest rating to date. Upon hearing the number, producer Michael Greenburg’s response was: “2.0? Geez, that‘s terrible!” And he would have been right - ten years earlier. Back when he was working on McGyver, ratings in the mid-20’s weren’t unheard of for a hit show. Today, a show is considered a huge success at half that number. Of course finding a solution is easier said than done because broadcasters recoup the licensing fees they pay for shows from advertisers - and advertisers are understandably reluctant to continue paying top dollar to reach an ever-dwindling audience. The beauty of personal recorders like Tivo (and any football fan who has had to sit through the commercials immediately following a score AND the ensuing kick-off will no doubt back me up here) is that it allows viewers to fast-forward through those annoying ads. Surprisingly, research has shown that about 50% of people who do record programming actually do sit through the commercials - but that’s still a 50% loss of eyeballs of the roughly 20% of viewers who prefer not to watch something live.

What to do? What to do? Well, maybe it’s time to consider more creative means of getting the message out there. Perhaps a lower screen scroll, akin to a sports ticker, could run through a broadcast trumpeting the merits of Mazda cars, Dentyne gum and an annual prostate examination. Maybe a company logo can subtly fade in and out a corner of the screen every few minutes or so, a ghostly reminder to eat at McDonalds, ship FedEx, and pay for it all with Mastercard. Or maybe product placement is the way to go. A new character joins the ever-growing Heroes roste - Orbitz, a sassy young girl with the power of flight and the ability to book you the lowest airline or hotel rate available. House cures Lupus through the healing powers of a cool, refreshing Coca-Cola. Don’t say no just yet. Think about it.

“So where does that leave Atlantis?” Good question. I know the anti-season-four-former-fans-of-the-show-with-nothing-better-to-do-but-gripe will claim that things like DVR, the internet, and the proliferation of channels are just excuses and that the real reason the ratings are down is because: 1) Character X is no longer on the show. 2) Character Y IS on the show. 3) We’re not doing enough wraith stories. 4) We’re doing too many wraith stories. 5) Teyla changed her hairstyle. 6) We repainted the set. 7) Whatever. - and they’re well within their rights to make said assumptions even though, in so doing, they demonstrate an almost inhuman amount of ignorance with regard to the reality of the situation. Throw in the fact that we were up against the season premiere of Numbers directed by Tony Scott and guest-starring Val Kilmer, and that we’ve lost our SG-1 lead-in…but I won’t even go there.

I’m still feeling very positive. To the fans of the show, I’d suggest you keep tuning in because a terrific fourth season of Atlantis awaits. To the non-fans and gripers who bemoan the new uniforms and Teyla’s different hairstyle, there is always the comforting world of fan fiction where Grodin never died, Ford is still a member of the team, and a magical little being named Grumblespire joins our heroes on their off-world adventures.

Today's pics: A windblown BamBam, Post Coordinator Kerry McDowell complaining because I never post pictures of her on my blog, Alan sounds the alarm, David Nykl drops off my end-of-season gift (To be perfectly honest, I was expecting a kitten).

Today's video: No video today but expect something very cool (er, blustery) tomorrow.

136 comments:

Anonymous said...

Hi Joe
Maybe you should release Atlantis-DVDs ship versions which will include ship-versions of the episodes.
How about you post that deleted scene on your blog instead of including it on the DVD? That should save up space for over deleted scenes.

Franklin said...

I know nuttin' about ratings - it is all too confusing.

Good job you wanted a kitten - there was a hell of a lot of cat litter in the last photograph from yesterday. If season 5 fails to materialise you could bag it and sell it in Fondy's shop.

Best wishes from Scotland.

Anonymous said...

Yikes! What happened to BamBam's hair? He's not stunt-doubling for Joe F there, by any chance? ;)

Anonymous said...

Oh Joe, those "non-fans" and "gripers" have bigger concerns about Atlantis than uniforms and hairstyles. You're obviously lurking on gateworld, you should know this. Thanks for attempting to trivialize them.

majorsal said...

anonymous said: "How about you post that deleted scene on your blog instead of including it on the DVD? That should save up space for over deleted scenes."

my number one preference would be for it to be in an actual episode.

i have a question for you, joe. when you said that sam/not-so-subtle reference might make it into a future episode, did you mean *that* exact scene, or just a redoing on the basic premise (sam talking relationship/jack)?



sally :)

bex said...

hey joe,
i love reading your blog and todays just made me smile! thankyou for continually being able to put a smile on my face at the end of the day before i sleep making me sleep better yet still moaning about having to get up so early for my shift! you have to work on that one. Maybe you can help by bestowing your culinary knowlegde upon me. I need to know of a few places to eat in burnaby. Where would you say is best on a student budget, somewhere that does a decent steak, nice italian, and please tell me you guys have a proper sunday dinner, or am i gonna have to make sure my mum teaches me exactly how to make it?

Unknown said...

Perhaps a lower screen scroll, maybe a company logo can subtly fade in and out a corner of the screen every few minutes or so,
produt placement.

I agree with all the above, it's the way to go, the internet does it with the banners (even if you don't click on them your mind still registers it). People would associate the brands with something they love, the power of association might just do it.

The Internet Is huge, I am sure that sci fi takes banners and website hits in consideration too, their website's popularity offers great opportunity for advertising and they know it.

I will keep my fingers crossed too, just like my husband is right now so the Red Sox win another division championship, but in my case for SGA to have season 5.

Have a good weekend!

Anonymous said...

Joe,

I for one still love Atlantis. It's still the only show I really love and the changes to the cast haven't changed my love for the show at all. I'm looking forward to the rest of season four and I still have hope for a season 5.

And if there isn't a season 5? Well I definitly won't be one of those puttng all of the blaim on you and the other producers and the writers. You guys all did what you thought was the right thing to do for the future of the show and I can't fault you for making changes to something that does belong to you, and not the fans, no matter what they may think.

Now, personally I'm hoping you get a season 5 so I can mock the naysayers for not the changes a chance.

Anonymous said...

Joe - you're awesome!

Thanks for breaking down the ratings issue for those layman amongst your readers (specifically me), who have no idea what they mean.

Is that to a goldfish?
Don't eat it.
You have no idea where it's been.

Looking forward to plenty of bluster.
:D Skip

Anonymous said...

Hi Joe!
I am commenting here for the first time.
Loads of the suggestions you made are already reality here (where "here" is some european contry called Germany). This kind of advertisement, topped by disgusting XXX-Ads in the night is pushing me away from watching TV at all even more.
I don't think that that is an solution. For me, legal, paid download would be one. I know that there is iTunes, but it doesn't work for someone without an US address. But I guess there are more international law issues than I am ever able to think of to open this possibility to the whole world, and so I am forced to WAIT for the new episodes for over an year.
Feels like still living in 1995...

Anonymous said...

iam still baffled that they dont include online downloads of stargate, i understand that some people might think its wrong donno the facts on it but their still numbers and some of us dont get scifi some have to wait till this weekend to watch it or the alternate of dl it. i agree with you that they have to change their ways of doing ratings. you should suggest adding in the number of dl into the rating maby? on another note i think what anonymous said would be awsome to see pranks and deleted scences from set.

Dustin

Unknown said...

Oh wait! is wednesday! why did I say good weekend?...see that's what insomnia will do to you.

Question:
what do you recommend for those sleepless nights?

Not meaning to be offensive but, actually the season 3 commentaries have help a lot to lulled me to sleep they few nights when I do manage any, must be the soothing voice of Martin Wood and Martin Gero.

;)

Anonymous said...

well said, lets just hope the ratings don't drop below 1.0, i will cry tears of blood if they do

by the way, why don't they count DVR in the final rating?

maybe this needs to change, if Atlantis viewers are advancing, the ratings should too..

firefly827347 said...

OMG Bambam's hair is awesome!!!
We need more Bambam cameos on the show. If we get a season 5 (oh please let us get a season 5) can Bambam have more roles please?

Unknown said...

Joe,

I wont comment on ratings. I can't. I know too little about them to pretend to be an insta-expert on the blog of someone who actually works in the TV industry.

What I will say however, is please, whenever the mood strikes. Post more pictures of Post Coordinator Kerry McDowell!

Never mind the actors on the show, some of the staff are hot!

Anonymous said...

Quoting Joe they’re well within their rights to make said assumptions even though, in so doing, they demonstrate an almost inhuman amount of ignorance with regard to the reality of the situation.

To do so, while hiding behind the tag "Anonymous" is worse.

Sadly, technological advances are also making inroads into the music industry, resulting in lower sales numbers for albums etc.

allison said...

You repainted the set?! Are you trying to get the show cancelled single-handedly?
...and what do you mean with that crack about Grodin? It's not like he's dead or anything.

Hey, do you want your personal Tartan Army to make a few house calls? Maybe have a little chat with some Scifi execs? Awesome pics, by the way. And don't you see? David's present of fish are actually just the food for the little kitten he hid in your desk drawer.

Anonymous said...

I was reading earlier today that last weeks episode of eureka which had been averaging somewhere between 1.7 and 1.8 had their ratings drop too 1.2 when they had to compete with network prime time new shows, this being said do you like the idea of premiering up against prime time network shows or would you have rather started earlier like some of the previous seasons have done.

Anonymous said...

Well I will say I have not lost hope, either. Atlantis is a show that is worth the pickup, and I will be watching faithfully every week. :) It will be interesting to see where things go.

*chuckles* I will say that, as a fanfiction writer and reader, that it is fun to play in the Stargate sandbox, so to speak. The characters are fun and diverse and of course sci-fi is a wide-open arena as far as the imagination goes. I have to say thank you, for giving us such a fun place to play. :)

Vern said...

Hi, Joe.

Will you post the updated ratings number when it comes out? A 1.2, huh? Considering technology today, that's pretty good. I expect a 0.2-0.5 increase when the adjustment are factored in, but that's my opinion. How's hiatus shaping up? Any plans for your birthday coming up?

G Alice Owen said...

And so it is said - and so it shall be. NOT. True,technology has created a new species, (yet unnamed with a complimentary identifi- cation) but let's consider this.

1. Suppose, just suppose, Atlantis vanished completely from the screen. Poof, no more. I guarantee there would be an outcry of yet unseen proportion (the voices of the nay sayers speaking with the fans in unison).

2. It is human nature, to a strong extent that the nay sayers will tune in just to see if they were right. Predictably, a respectable number of folks will become fans again based on something they saw on that episode they watched to prove themselves right in the first place. So, the tide turns back to the good. You've seen it happen, yes?

3. There are a great number of people who don't know how to appreciate the joys in life including a really cool TV show that diverts their minds for an hour or so from the grind of the day.

4. A loyal fan base is crucial even if there are a few changes here and there, the premise that attracted you to the series in the first place is still there! I doubt seriously the actors who have a change of plans for whatever reason about their appearance would want the fan base to turn their backs on the show itself. Check out their websites, they ALL are still PRO Atlantis. I've been there and read them.

For me, a reality check. (hang on I'm only 5'3" and need to climb upon my soap box here). I hope that Atlantis does well. I get a lot of enjoyment from the story lines and the character development. I want so very much for Atlantis to spike the ratings and be around for many years.

People and circumstances change in reality as well as in scifi (actually more so in scifi) and that's part of the joy of tuning in - to see what's new and what's familiar. The twists and turns and techno effects.

If there is something about Atlantis that you don't like, hang in there, something will catch and hold your attention, reaffirming your loyalty on possibly another level. Be open to the possibilities and the potentials.

Lighten up guys. Both sides of the "line" of actor loyalty need erase the "line" in the sand, enjoy what's there because, like every- thing else in life, including life itself, it won't be there forever.

Enjoy it and support it by real time viewing, SciFi Friday Nights, buy the box sets, hit the websites and participate with the promo- tional advertising. Please don't let it be gone because of apathy or misplaced hard feelings.

Life is too short for that. To the entire staff, crew and actors, support teams and fans, kudos and know that you ARE appreciated by those of us who refuse to split hairs.

**Joe, you can choose to allow this comment or edit it - I will under- stand if you decide it's too harsh.**

ladyconure

Anonymous said...

I don't know how the ratings stuff works, but I'm glad to hear they're taking DVRs into consideration. Does that mean they're counting how many DVRs are recording an episode, or does it mean they're counting how many times the episode is watched on DVR? If we watch an episode more than once (ie. watching the episode both times it airs on Friday nights or watching the recorded episode multiple times), does that help boost ratings?

M said...

Hey Joe,

I saw the ratings and freaked out - espeically when I knew that SGA was up for consideration by scifi.

I hope that things are better than they look coz to be honest, a Friday 10pm timeslot is not easy! I have lots of shows that I'd like to watch on Friday night but I can't as I'm not home most Friday nights.

Lovely pics. Ah, is that a goldfish for you? It looks like it's running out of air.

Take care and keep us appraised of the ratings etc. I really think that SGA s4 is going to be a kick-ass season!

Ta,
M

ZoniDuck said...

and a magical little being named Grumblespire joins our heroes on their off-world adventures

I've read that fic. I thought Ronon was horribly out of character, and Grumblespire was a total MarySue, but Grumblespire/Sheppard is so hot, I'm willing to overlook the plot holes.

Dovil said...

I have to admit feeling slightly sheepish about the amount of time and energy I've been spending squeeing over a tv show - I'm going to cling to the idea that it's my substitution for following a sports team, though may have to abandon this if every add break requires leaping up screaming and waving around a giant novelty foam hand. But to spend all that time on something that you're just 'meh' about or hate? They should use their time more productively, like sudouko, or volunteer work with the elderly, or beating baby seals to death with the wheelchairs of orphans - things they can really find joy in.

Can you get sponsorship from the US Military? Sheppard can take time out to smile widely and gaze off into the distance as an American flag whips about dramatically behind him and the recruitment hotline scrolls underneath. Then he can kill stuff. The military loves that kind of thing.

Though I draw the line at Ronald McDonald being made the new leader. Just no.

Anonymous said...

Joe, I'm confused. SciFi already released the ratings for last nights episode of Eureka. It got a 1.4. Why didn't SciFi hold onto Eurekas' ratings and take all of the other things into consideration like they are going to do for Atlantis? Wouldn't they also want Eureka to get the best possible ratings too? By their releasing Eurekas' ratings over-night, it comes across as if they are only doing this for Atlantis. Sorry, but I am extremely confused. Could you please explain it a little more?

Agent Dark said...

LOL. You hit the mark dead on about the 'anti' fans. Adrift and Doppleganger were excellent, and I can't wait for the rest of season 4 :D

Anonymous said...

You had me laughing at your product placement idea.

I do hope the fish from Mr. Nykl are well received and loved by you. :)

Unknown said...

OK I'm commenting a lot today, but hubby found this and thought other Star wars fans would enjoy them, funny editing.

Thought it might put a smile on you. ;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5blbv4WFriM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QKgedWvW3FM

and of course the classic;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6A0rwG39Jzk

Emma said...

The amount of advertising which interrupts my viewing experience is what I detest these days, so I have been known to watch online now and again. I still pretty much always tune into shows I like on the tube anyway and watch again, and again, and....well you get the idea.

As for the 'I won't ever watch again because (insert petty reason here) happened' surely it's the writing, themes, style, idea etc which attracted a person to a show in the first place, IMO anyway.....rant over, still waiting in anticipaition for the premiere in the UK and will happily be curled up on the sofa with a cuppa and a bar of Dairy Milk...much like I did 20 years ago when MacGyver were on.

Anonymous said...

Hi Joe,
Here's a way to get the Sam/Jack shippers to stop asking for a resolution.... Put the deleted "not-so-subtle hint" scene back in Trio, and shippers will be happy, satisfied, and not have to bug you anymore :-)
(That would include me :-))
Thanks!

gatedialer said...

Thanks for giving us the rundown on ratings. I don't care who is on SGA, I'm going to keep watching it.

Anonymous said...

Today's current standard of measuring all that really is not as up to date as it should be, nevermind the other methods people watch shows now-a-days which has made the television obselete. But Val Kilmer has nothing on SGA or SG-1. Glad to know you're keeping your head up about the ratings. Can't wait until Friday!

Anonymous said...

Just wanted to say I loved "Adrift" and can't wait to see the next episode. Actually, I can't wait to see all the episodes this season. Every teaser behind-the-scenes photo you post just makes me more excited about what's coming up.

Anonymous said...

Who's Val Kilmer?

A lot of people would stop bugging you if you put the scene that you deleted from Trio back in. The scene can't be more than a few minutes long, so all you have to do is cut a few seconds of this, a few seconds of that, etc., it all adds up really fast!

Warning: Goldfish are very hard to take care of and tend to end up dying. I know this because all the goldfish I've gotten have died [except for the one that got stolen]. Good luck, you'll need it!

Amz said...

If people reviewed blog posts, this would be the one I'd do.

Thanks for the ratings information and the humour you added into it. The relationship(s) of entertainment and technology fascinate me, so it's great to get another perspective.

Anonymous said...

House! Eureka pulled a 1.2 going up against the premier of House! Do any of you realize what an enormous juggernaut House has become when it comes to viewers? The show is actually still growing viewers in its fourth season! The last show to probably do that was CSI or SG-1. A 1.2 against such a tv event is a fantastic rating, and the scifi channel, the people at Eureka, and the people at Stargate all know it. This isn't meant as a dig, but if Atlantis' Adrift were up against the House premier they would have been lucky to pull in above a 1.0.

Anonymous said...

"The Powers That Be are going to have to adjust the way they gather and weigh ratings"

Or maybe work on a new business model? One built with the understanding that the level of control they once had ain't coming back. One based on selling entertainment to people, instead of eyeballs to advertisers.

I think projects such as Sanctuary are pioneering the new business model. Yes, their reach it tiny, for the moment. I look forward to seeing models of direct selling of shows to audiences grow. Maybe internet extended pilot, leading to subscription based production? Want better production values? Get your friends to subscribe.

Broadcast and cable are becoming ever more irrelevant, throwing more and more crap at the wall hoping something will stick. My cable company adds a new digital package every couple of months, yet they won't do any sort of 'pick 5' or 'pick 10' package, allowing the customer to choose the channels they are interested in. To get SciFi, I was paying an extra $40+ per month. Yeah, it came with about 50 other channels, maybe three of which I watched occasionally. It wasn't worth the money, especially once I could wait one day and get the shows off iTunes. I could spend under $40 for a full season without commercials, or I could spend $40+ per month and have not just commercials, but soaps (Passions) and wrestling on a channel that advertises itself as devoted to science fiction.

"Perhaps a lower screen scroll"

I am already on the verge of dumping TV entirely (in favor of the internet and NetFlix). This would most definitely push me over the edge. I got a DVR (not Tivo, don't need the spyware, thanks) for the express purpose of skipping the ads. Skiffy's bottom of the screen ads (promoting whatever suck-fest they're using to fill time this week) were bad enough. They only invade the first 15 to 30 seconds of a scene. If the choice is continuous ads along the bottom of the screen, or wait for the DVD/ other digital, commercial-free release, I'll wait.

To the poster above who said people would accept this like they do pop-ups and banner ads... No, people install AdBlock Plus, or other highly effective ad-blocking software to avoid that stuff on the internet.

Riley said...

Hi Joe,

My flatmate and I watched "Adrift" last night, and I just wanted to let you know that we absolutely *loved* it. It was one hell of a season opener. So many good things about it ... and it left us yelling for More! Right now! Can't wait for the next episode. I so hope it gets picked up for another season ... jeez, it's the only show I can really be bothered to seek out and watch - I'd be happy if it went on until the cast members become grandparents! Anyway, great ep - well done to crew and cast. Eagerly awaiting the weekend for the next instalment.

Charles Schneider said...

You make some very good points, thanks for putting a lot into perspective for non-industry types like myself. I have no doubt that Atlantis will come back for season 5 (obligatory knock on wood).

As great as it is to be able to ask you questions directly, if we want to mail in old-school letters of praise, where do we address them to?

I understand that as long as we put the studios address and the person's name we are sending it to they'll eventually get it once its scanned for anthrax, body parts, and anything else you never want to get in the mail.

RachelC said...

The 'nice' thing about it being against Numb3rs is that CBS have the show on their Innertube so I can watch that online later. It's always better when a network has online episodes so you can catch up when you want to

Anonymous said...

“So where does that leave Atlantis?” Good question. I know the anti-season-four-former-fans-of-the-show-with-nothing-better-to-do-but-gripe will claim that things like DVR, the internet, and the proliferation of channels are just excuses and that the real reason the ratings are down is because: 1) Character X is no longer on the show. 2) Character Y IS on the show. 3) We’re not doing enough wraith stories. 4) We’re doing too many wraith stories. 5) Teyla changed her hairstyle. 6) We repainted the set. 7) Whatever. - and they’re well within their rights to make said assumptions even though, in so doing, they demonstrate an almost inhuman amount of ignorance with regard to the reality of the situation. Throw in the fact that we were up against the season premiere of Numbers directed by Tony Scott and guest-starring Val Kilmer, and that we’ve lost our SG-1 lead-in…but I won’t even go there."

Joe -

Indicating that a group of fans (“former” or not) are demonstrating an “inhuman amount of ignorance” is an interesting tactic to take by a show runner.

I know you've taken your fair share of flack for the upcoming season. I guess as show runner, taking the flack goes hand in hand with all of the kudos and congratulations you've received as well.

I have posted in the anti-season 4 thread on GW. From my observation, I can tell you there appear to be different kinds of fans who post in that thread.

Yes, there are some fans who truly wish the show would end because to them it's not the same show anymore. They're upset, they're angry and they choose to express themselves in that manner. Right or wrong, it is what it is.

There are also some fans who post there who aren't anti the entire season, they just don't like all the changes that have been made. Granted, they haven't watched the entire season develop as you have during the production of it, but keep in mind - IF what drew them into the SGA world were the characters and the team and how they interacted with each other, when two of those characters are now, in effect, gone, it is hard to have the same enthusiasm and love for the show you once had.

And, there are probably other "types" or "groups" of fans out there who consider themselves "anti" in some way, shape or form

Right now, I'm in the second group. And, I happen to believe that some of the changes may very well have an effect on the ratings this year. I won't presume to say they would have everything to do with it, but I also wouldn't assume they would have little or nothing to do with it, either.

Right now, I guess I’m in the group of people who isn’t thrilled with the Season 4 plan, but is still hoping for a Season 5 so I have at least some chance to have my favorite character back, hopefully on a full-time basis again.

When a fan, or a group of fans feel they have been disenfranchised from a show, they tend to leave the viewership.

All I ask is that you consider the possibility that there are fans out there who right now feel disenfranchised from this show but don’t necessarily want to see it go down in flames, either. Perhaps choosing your words carefully would keep those folks engaged in the franchise in some way?

Isn’t the entertainment industry similar to the retail industry where the fan, in effect, is the customer? Maybe not the only customer, but a very important one nonetheless?

SMB_BOOKS

Anonymous said...

I feel like Martin Lloyd..."No, really!" It's no coincidence that you guys were getting your highest ratings during seasons seven and eight, the years where that awful, horrible, verboten Sam/Jack ship was a serious story arc for the show. And it's no coincidence that the ratings took a nose dive when it became apparent that it wouldn't be part of the show anymore and that you weren't going to resolve it. I don't understand your (TPTB's) general reluctance towards and fear of this plotline. It bumps ratings, plain and simple. You've got the figures, you know it already.

"No, really!"

KirFect said...

Hello Joe.

Did you know that the Nielsen group (yes the ones with the black boxes or whatever they are) is also starting to change how the do research as well. Stargate Atlantis is ranked number 1 for TV and Number Overall on their Hey Nielson website. I thought you would like to know that somewhere Atlantis is making move up.

heynielsen.com

Anonymous said...

Well Joe you've done it again. You could have took the high road, but no, you have to lower yourself down to the level of some of the "anti"'s who are griping about the show and the some of the "pro"'s who delight in trying to bait the "anti"'s on a number of message boards so they can use their juvenile "gamer speak." Personally, I am in the wait and see crowd for Season 4 because of the disappointment of some very poor episodes in seasons 2 and 3. I am somewhat optimistic about season 4 from what I heard about it, but until I see more episodes, I have to say I have reservations. Adrift was a so-so episode only saved by great special effects and adequate acting. I am hoping Lifeline will be better because it won't have a "to be continued" at the end of it.

I think the reasons you give to explain the lower rating numbers are valid especially the different time of year for the premiere. However, I think it would be irresponsible (reference intended) of you not to think there may be a backlash of fans who liked the characters that have been removed and/or dislike the characters that have added. I really can't say if SGA deserves another season or not because the season is just starting. In the end, all you and the rest of TPTBs can do is present what you think is the best product possible and hope you get enough viewers to agree with you. If they don't, you will have to look for other work while helping Fondy out, but don't blame the "anti"'s if this comes to pass. There is always Loki or another God to blame. ;)

brains103 said...

I am glad to hear that they will be taking into account DVRs and such for the ratings. I think you got it exactly right when you talked about the gripers and anti-season 4 people. While I'm not belittling Stargate Atlantis at all...(in the words of Jack O'Neill) For cryin' out loud! It's a show, albeit an outstanding one. Can't people just be happy to have the Stargate franchise continue???

Yin said...

I love SGA with all my heart, and I know my friends and I are all crossing our fingers for season 5! It's the only show I make sure to watch on TV~ I'll be so heartbroken if we don't get a S5 pickup!

One episode in and I'm already in love with this season. *_* <3<3 Thanks for all the hard work! :D

Anonymous said...

Dear Joe

Well, come on. You can't expect to please all the people all the time. And a big fat raspberry to the 'gripers' and 'whingers'...if they can do better, tell them to make their own damn TV series.

As for funding, how does 'syndication' work? And what about upping the merchandise? You got a worldwide audience who happily buy up SG-1/SGA goodies - maybe a series of plush toy Sheppards & McKays, or life-size (anatomically correct) 'dolls' for us big girls to play with??

kidding...well, maybe not.

Smirks and schmoozes,
Dana


btw, is David's fish called Wanda? *snort*

Anonymous said...

Joe,

Adrift was AWESOME! I liked it a lot. But DG was FAN......oh....sorry!

Anywho, I do hope that ratings get better because I want a Season 5.

Btw, didn't you mention that Scifi would broadcast in HD this season or did I dream that?

Take a deep breath and here's a big box of virtual chocolates for you and Fondy.

*crosses fingers* And HERE's To SEASON 5!!!! *Cheers*

Remind me to write next time about the PUG Pub that I went to for lunch the other day.

Camy

Anonymous said...

Extremely informative post. Now I understand the difficulties involved in determining the popularity of TV shows. And I do agree that the time has come to find new ways to determine viewership numbers taking into account all of the ways that program watching occurs. I'm very interested in hearing what the final numbers are. Thanks for giving us "Nielson Ratings for Dummies"!

Anonymous said...

Mr. M, as has been said, thanks for the breakdown. It is a pity that some folk need to be dragged into the current century, kicking and fighting the whole way. I am fervently hoping good karma and season 5 is coming our way!

Tauri Sith said...

"...and a magical little being named Grumblespire joins our heroes on their off-world adventures."
I could swear I never did post that story. Oh well - I'll just work on the sequel. Let me see... Grumblespire and his love interest, Bethildenshpikt, split up. Sam falls for him Grumblespire and Bethildenshpikt elopes with a Wraith to a pleasant little planet called Ifrinn.

majorsal said...

Anonymous said...
"Hi Joe,
Here's a way to get the Sam/Jack shippers to stop asking for a resolution.... Put the deleted "not-so-subtle hint" scene back in Trio, and shippers will be happy, satisfied, and not have to bug you anymore :-)
(That would include me :-))
Thanks!"


it wouldn't stop ME from asking for more!:p like, *showing* some romance between them (kissing would be a good start!).

all joking aside, when something is great, you just want MORE.

{to anonymous shipper above, i'm sorry}




sally :)

Anonymous said...

1.)Will we see effects as good as in Adrift more often this season?
2.)Will there be a lot more deaths this season?
3.)Can you give us any hint on what the season finale will be about?

Anonymous said...

I have to tell you - I love Atlantis. The job you all do turning out the series is just amazing and thank you! I look forward to it each week, and I would miss it terribly if it wasn't on the air.

This summer, a massive infection caused my lung to collapse this summer resulting in emergency surgery and a month-long hospital stay with about a zillion tubes running in and out of me.

My sister saved my sanity by bringing in her laptop and my season one and two DVDs. I spent a lot of time not-sleeping due to the pain, and a lot of time propped up watching Atlantis episodes and thank heavens for them because they let me focus on something pleasant instead of how much agony I was in physically.

Thornyrose said...

I admit I'm utilizing the internet to view episodes, simply because my job doesnt always allow me to view the show directly. I do however watch the network broadcast as much as possible. Thanks for the job you've been doing and fingers crossed that we get to bemoan the same issues for season five. And a terrific season premiere btw. Special kudos to M. Gero's script, the cast's on the nose acting, and the special effects folks' efforts.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous said...

"Hi Joe, Here's a way to get the Sam/Jack shippers to stop asking for a resolution.... Put the deleted "not-so-subtle hint" scene back in Trio, and shippers will be happy, satisfied, and not have to bug you anymore :-) (That would include me :-)) Thanks!"


That would not satisfy the Sam/Jack shippers.

They'd want the dinner date; the proposal; the ring; telling all the SGC and SGA that they've secretly been together since before S1; planing the wedding; the wedding; the honeymoon and photos all over Sam's office; Sam's pregnancy and birth of the first child (Grace of course); Grace's first steps and birthday party, the conception of the second child (turns out to be triplets called Gracie Jo, Jacqui Grace and Sammie Grace); then their first day at school; their first lot of measles/mumps; riding their first bikes and coming home from school upset at the nasty children and Mommy telling them via subspace communication that they are wonderful and beautiful and special; Jack being Daddy and interrogating prospective boyfriends from his retirement home; their graduations and weddings, birth of the first grandchild and finally a scene where Sam and Jack reminisce happily about their wonderful life and soul shattering love of each other.

Did I miss anything?

Oh yeah, the fishing scene! Can't miss the fishing scene where they tell Teal'c and Daniel that they have always been in love since their eyes first meet across the high school/elementary school fence!

Sam/Jack - bored now.

RebeccaH said...

I'm of the demographic that is ignored by everyone anyway, so it doesn't matter that I have to be out of the house on Friday nights (at least until high school football is over). However, even though I tend to DVR a lot of shows and zap through commercials, I will stop and back it up if my eye catches something interesting. Commercials sometimes can be pretty darned entertaining. More so, in fact, than that crap that's always popping up at the bottom of the screen and obscuring things like credits and subtitles. But it's heartening to know that TPTB are beginning to consider such things.

I've noticed too that the people who post sour anti-SGA comments here usually do so anonymously, which should tell you something.

And, just for the record, goldfish stink. I hate goldfish. No disrespect to David Nykl, who probably meant well. ;-)

Crystal said...

Interesting argument over whether Sam should bring her "Jack" baggage to Atlantis or leave it in SG-1 and its movies.

Of course, that does predispose that "Jack" is her baggage. There are many of us who don't see Jack as her baggage to bring over -- who see wonderful chemistry between Rick and Amanda in Behind the Scenes shooting but who don't see that Jack ever expressed much interest in her at all.

And who wish that red herring baggage would all be left as a thing in the past where it belongs so they could go back to seeing Sam as the great professional woman she once was for them.

Anonymous said...

I wish Sci-Fi had scheduled Doctor Who to air before Atlantis. I gotta admit that I can't stomach the Flash Gordon show that's on before SGA now. I watch Doctor Who; flip the tube for an hour and turn back in time for SGA. I may be in the minority(?) but I miss SGA at the 9:00 time-slot.

Emily said...

Ok, I haven't been able to watch the season premiere yet due to currently being on a road trip (hey, our hotel in Ogden, Utah didn't have the SciFi channel...go figure), but...

Teyla has a new hairstyle??? Wha???

Ok, I offically am quitting this show. That is the LAST straw.

Pretty soon you're going to, like, change all their shoe brands or something. I can't take all this change. The soul of the show is now completely eviscerated.

Iris said...

"Adrift" was wonderful which tells me things are A-OK on your end. I am conident teh ratings will rise. Can you please ask NBC/Sci-Fi to consider giving SG-1 the sort of well planned ad campaigns it gives its USA shows (like Monk and Psych)? I guarantee it would boost ratings.

That being said, I'm sure the DVR ratings will be huge. Please keep us posted and keep the "hater" vitriol coming!

Royal

Keirberos said...

Actually, the scrolling ticker thing wouldn't be so bad... If it could be removed for syndication and (obviously) DVDs... So long as it was inobtrusive, not real garish, and didn't detract from the episode being shown (kind've like SciFi was doing with their 'takes up a quarter of the screen' SG-1 s10 corner-ad, I hate to say), I could put up with it on the initial airings and online. Maybe it ghosted itself? That would keep any bright colors or cartoonish logos from interfering as we attempt to directly download the peisode into our brains.

Pluses would be, the ads would be there even if recorded, with DVR or otherwise. And, for us, we could ignore them just as easily as we normally do. (Actually, if I could get all my commercials condensed into this format and then just skip the several-minute-long breaks in the middle, I would.) But, hey, added bonus (and completely commercial) it would also encourage people to buy DVDs instead of just taping the initial airings and watching those. I know, not many people still do that, but *shrugs* I don't know if you were being entirely sarcastic or serious or what, but, you may just be on to something there.

Moving on to more inane things... Can't say how pathetically comforted I was by your reassurances on the ratings. :D At once, I make myself amused, scared, and so very depressed... Methinks I'm a lost cause, but I doubt I'm alone in that... Wow, why do you even associate with us geeks? >D

And, uh, I know it's been said, but, I have to throw in my two cents worth (more like one and a half really) and say, when I first saw the picture of BamBam, I thought of Joe F. as well. Though I hardly think his hair is really that silly looking, I mean, come on... That wig's just ridiculous.

Oh, hey, if you don't mind my asking, what kind've fish did David N. get you? I can guess they're not Bettas, judging from the coloring and the fact that they're not trying to kill one another. Goldfish?

Moon Princess said...

Your blog is fantastic, Joe! I am very excited about season 4. You all do a great job and I can't wait to see what you're going to come up with.

Any chance of posting bloopers here or adding them to the season 4 DVD set?

abharding said...

Joe,

Thanks for the lesson on the new TV ratings. I don't know if you know it or not (for all I know this could have been in papers across the US.) but there was nice article in the Washington Post (www.washtingtonpost.com) on this very subject - and how it is making figuring out ratings a lot trickier and that it takes a lot longer to know how many people were watching. It was very interesting and raised some of points you made as well.

Moon Princess said...

Your blog is fantastic, Joe! I am very excited about season 4. You all do a great job and I can't wait to see what you're going to come up with.

Any chance of posting bloopers here or adding them to the season 4 DVD set?

Anonymous said...

Hello Mr. M!

As a former huge Numb3rs fan who still watches it, it would still be no contest which one to watch (though of course I watched Numb3rs, being in Canada and unable to watch SciFi). But my heart was with you guys. :)

Yesterday (the 2nd) you made a remark re: Mr. David Hewlett's aged face regarding fatherhood. Combining that with three-day silence on his website... may I ask, has "Hewlett 2.0" made his (or her) appearance? Are congratulations in order for Mr. H and his lovely wife-to-be?

If you don't think the question is appropriate, please disregard. I just love babies and am so happy for them.

If it's true, whether or not you answer this outright, please do pass on the fans' congratulations!

SusanW

Anonymous said...

We watched SGA and taped Numb3rs, getting the best of both worlds. Good times, good times.

Anonymous said...

As a long time Stargate fan, and fairly new to 'online' attitudes, I'm disappointed at all the bitchyness.

I love Atlantis. As a matter a fact, I now love it MORE than SG1. I support the show, I talk about it all the time, I attend conventions, I bug Sci-Fi, and I talk positive about it.

Was I a little unsure about the proposed move of Sam to Atlantis, yes, of course. I like Sheppard as Military Commander, I like McKay's genius to save them and him as CSO. While I like Sam as a character in the SG1 team, the move of her to leader, especially in charge over McKay was a lot to take. Many did not like her attitude towards McKay on SG1 episodes, and the fact that when it was her and him - she was almost always right. I also didn't want her on the 'team'. From comments on upcoming episodes, you've all worked with this. Those that bad mouth and don't watch - well, they miss a great show. I have great hopes you will respect the Atlantis characters who DO have a really great chemistry together and not toss everything to make Sam into a 'superwoman' like the Sci-Fi ads have made it seem.

And thank you for pics and teases to keep us going.

Anonymous said...

Here's a way to get the Sam/Jack shippers to stop asking for a resolution.... Put the deleted "not-so-subtle hint" scene back in Trio, and shippers will be happy, satisfied, and not have to bug you anymore :-)


You think so?

I think that reference to "a guy in Washington" is no more concrete than any of the other shipper shout-outs.

Lots of the shippers won't be satisfied.

Since there seems to be some storyline reason that the thing is still open for interpretation after all these years, what's the point of another hint which may be, might be, could be Jack but we're not saying his name, probably is but maybe not--that won't really resolve anything?

I say, let it go...free Sam.

Jenny Robin said...

Excellent on the goldfish. Now you can have a miniature stargate created by the props department, and you can place it in the tank, just as I am wanting to do with one of my tanks.

I have a 29-gallon fish tank at home and a 20-gallon tank at work. If you need any fish-keeping advice, let me know.

Goldfish love mandarin orange slices.

Anonymous said...

I'm a senior in high school and beginning the application process for colleges and universities with the intention of majoring in Screenwriting and/or Directing for Television. I've already done a couple internship programs and workshops through NYU and while that school is ideal, the cost is overwhelmingly expensive. So, I was wondering if you had any possible suggestions for proficient universities, in that field, without the big price tag?

Kellie said...

Thanks for the ratings info. Let's hope the network is as progressive as some of it's entertainment content and that it makes its renewal decision on faith in the fans despite the changing ratings landscape. I'm definitely sending my goodwill hippie vibes out there for a fifth season. But if the show doesn't get picked up again... maybe the inmate demographic will team up with the leprechauns and women aged 31-33.5 to get revenge.

P.S. Did you get my response to your e-mail?

Crystal said...

Joe,

I meant to say earlier...

When I was reading through your list of possible advertising alternatives (scrawls and whatnot), which I certainly hoped was tongue-in-cheek, I was thinking back to a post I had done on my TVGuide blog which decried how unhappy I was to watch Eureka through a half-screen size continual burn for the upcoming 'Ghost Hunters' premiere. And that my rebellion is that I won't watch any show whose flagrant advertisement ruins the enjoyment of what I had on. And I didn't.

I would hate it if my viewing pleasure of watching Atlantis was so ruined by advertising burns and crawls as to make it unwatchable.

With my limited time, I'm prone to fast forward through commercials too, but before VCRs, I did my homework during commercials, went for snacks, to the bathroom, did housework. I also find that a well-done, interesting commercial has lured me into watching it, despite my desire to fast forward over commercials... and I've even been caught watching a commercial I like every single time it's on. Can you imagine that? Maybe what it takes is better commercials?

Tesajb said...

Three words: Stargate in Concert.

I'd love to sit through a nice orchestral concert of Stargate Music. Seriously.

But I have to admit I'm one of the 50% who stick my nose right back into my computer monitor the moment the commercials come on. I'm a busy busy person and even late in the evening I can spare no time; minus my precious Stargate time that is. =D.

Too bad you didn't get that kitten. I've had this super awesome cat for the last 8 years and I couldn't ask for a better pet. He chirps and trills and purrs and cuddles. Even at 8 he's still playful like a kitten. Not to mention he excels in the skillfull art of catching wild mice and rats. I only lose that benefit when he brings them inside. Alive.

Lots of personality that one.

Then again fish can be good pets too. I've had many fish, Koi even. Goldfish can grow rather big and be rather long lived if kept in larger aquariums. Our Koi lived for about 10 years in an outdoor pond.

I miss the giant gold one =(.

Anonymous said...

Okay so I must admit that I am a little confused about the anti s4 folk! They seem really happy to get the show cancelled - but also many seem to spend a lot of time trying to get their fave character back! Doesnt that seem a little strange- why bother if you dont want the show to continue? Something seems a little misplaced here!!!!

If you want your character back then surely you need to support the current show so that this becomes a possibility??

Anonymous said...

Hi Joe,

Of course technology is the major cause for the drop in ratings, but surely you guys should accept some responsibility about the effects that changes you make have on the show; albeit that those effects are miniscule in comparision to that of dvd etc et. If the ratings had risen dramatically I am sure you would have accepted the praise.

Anonymous said...

Hello Joe, greetings from Italy!

So, first time poster here, even if I've dropped by occasionally to read some news and musings about my favorite show.

Now, I won't comment on ratings: there are too many factors to take into account here, so we'll see how the season develops.

Anti-S4 fans active on forums aren't enough to make a difference in ratings (as you rightly point out), and remember that most of them are still watching the show at this point.

That's why I think you shouldn't hurl yourself against them. The reasons you point out in your post are of course ironic, but idle, and for most watchers they constitute the last proverbial straw.

People are known to have different tastes, and will watch (and praise) a show when that show pleases their expectations / is entertaining for them.You can't make everyone happy, I think you're perfectly aware of that.

Now, consider that these lemmings / gleeful haters / whatever, are, as a matter of fact, still in the loop. You have a better chance at regaining them as viewers than a casual viewers who's not invested in the show.

They might watch S4 and see that it's not as bad as they thought, or take a few episodes off and then go back, if the show can pique their interest again.

I'm quoting a personal experience here. I had a brief period when I was watching SG1 only occasionally, namely S8 and 9, but in the end, I went back. And I'm not sure I would have if I hadn't been around in fandom during that personal hiatus.

Amy Lynn said...

Wonder if the nielsen net ratings can and or do ever play into the world of tv ratings.

Unknown said...

When I DVR a show I still passively watch adverts when fast forwarding through them. It's up to the advertisers to be clever here. In the UK one of our channels, FX, capitalised on this they had a series of still images promoting a new show. So fast forwarding you saw action shots from the show with a strapline that always stayed there.

When watching the commercial live it had intense music and a voiceover, the still images were slowly zooming in and out in a Ken Burns style effect.

So companies can follow this idea, for example they could have a strapline at the bottom of their ad saying Buy Coca-Cola.

Anonymous said...

I just see Doppelganger. Great episode. The scene with the clown cracks me up to no end; Robert cooper is a genius, really. I’m sorry to hear that ratings not doing well.
Well, I know this is a kinda old question, but I want to ask if sometime (better now, of course) we would know why and that means the change need to be made” (Robert Cooper words).

Anonymous said...

Dear Joe,


1. How many episodes in season 4 will have a zpm story, or zpm quest-related story as main or secondary theme? This of course excludes Adrift and Lifeline.

2. Also will we ever see or hear about the fates of the three full zpms that were encountered in the past seasons: the one the Daganians have, the one defending the antartic base and the one aboard the odysee battlecruiser.

3. Will the Tria appear or be talked about in season 4?

4. Any regrets during the filming or production of season 4?

5. What's your gut feeling on season 5? Pecentage wise, 0% not gonna happen...100% for sure with flying colors.


Thanks you sir

Alicia

Anonymous said...

Dear Joe,

Is Radek that cheap... getting you minuscle fishes for a present? Wow, I mean with the salary you authorize for the actors I think a 2 maybe 3 thousand dollar gift is the least thing one can do. If see him tell him to stop countin pennies.

yours truly,

Heineken

Anonymous said...

Hi Joe

I haven’t watched Adrift yet – it’s not being shown in the UK until next Tuesday evening – but I truly believe that all the cast changes, costume changes, set changes you mention will have no effect on the enjoyment I get from the show itself. It’s too good for that.

I would really not like to see advert banners etc on screen, but if they were needed to get us a fifth Season, I would welcome them with open arms.

Quick question – Are there any other channels in the US who might pick up the show and work like the BBC? ie, no adverts – income from TV licenses (or an equivalent), DVD sales and overseas sales of programmes?

Anonymous said...

Hi Joe,
I would hate to think that people would be more worried about hairstyles and leathers than the fate of a fantastic show. Personally, they could all be bald and wearing bin bags, as long as it meant a season 5 pickup!!
As for the memory of old characters and the fear of new ones... I loved Carson Beckett, he was a fellow Scot, what is not to like! BUT, if him bing blown to pieces made me turn off then why the hell was I watching the show to begin with?? Because it is a great show!!! And Keller's character promises to be just as good as Beckett's. As for Sam, what's the problem? She was fantastic in SG1 which I followed until the end. Yeah, I have reservations of what her presence will do to McKay, but I want to watch it all first before I make MY mind up!
Will be watching on the edge of my seat when Adrift premieres here in a weeks time!!!
Thank you for such a fantastic show!!!!
Fraggle D

JohnManzione said...

Yesterday my wife and I took my mother-in-law to the Christie MaAuliffe Planetarium in town. The show was narrated by John Delancy (Q) and the staff woman asked us if we were familiar with "Star Trek". My wife shouted back, "Stargate"! and the staff woman freaked out, she was a huge Stargate fan herself and my wife had a several minute conversation about the "gates" and how Delancy was a veteran of Stargate as well as Trek. It was amusing to watch this women delay the start of the planetarium show while discussing Stargate. Just thought you should know...

Ratings? Considering the Friday night time slot, the time of the year, the lead in shows, and the network its on, I think a 1.2 is actually pretty good.

"Adrift" was an excellent episode in every respect, I can't understand any fan not liking it. That said, since Atlantis is the only show we watch on the SciFi channel it makes sense to record it for later. Perhaps is SciFi created a "Stargate Friday" with 3 1-hour shows we'd watch them all live, but to take an hour out of a Friday night to watch a show littered with advertising is just a waste of time when there are alternative ways to watch.

Anonymous said...

"a magical little being named Grumblespire joins our heroes on their off-world adventures." LMAO!! I would love to see that episode!

I really wish I got the Sci-fi channel so I could watch SGA and help the ratings! I'm guessing TMN ratings don't count *sigh*

Adrift just aired on TMN and it was awesome! I loved the Space Walk scene and of course the "asteroid video game" sequence. Season Four is going to rock!

Anonymous said...

an almost inhuman amount of ignorance with regard to the reality of the situation.

I still love Atlantis. I still love the characters. I honestly don't like some of the changes but i'm baring with it because i've loved the show since the beginning. It's true that Elizabeth roped me into the world of Atlantis...but that doesn't mean that i'm giving up because she's gone. I'm dubious, of course, but who isn't when your favourite character is just suddenly removed from a show with - as far as we know - no reason.

Though, with that said. I don't think your comment is fair. Some fans might be boycotting because they don't like the changes, they may be upset and you may be right, we are ignorant, but that's because the information is kept from us. I'm not saying that that's wrong(it's in fact perfectly legitimate for a television franchise), but for you, an executive producer to make these subtle little remarks against the people who watch your show, it's a little childist.

You aren't wrong to be disappointed that a portion of your fanbase is leaving you, or that your ratings are a little lower for a multitude of different reasons. But to pick on fans for being ignorant, when it's you (in part) who have made them ignorant, is unfair.

You make a fantastic show. But please, cut the nay-sayers a break, they're only disgruntled fans who are feeling a little hurt by the changes. They'll get over it, or they won't, but that's up to them.

btw, 'Adrift' and 'Doppleganger' were ACE. Doppleganger terrified me! Honestly. But my hat's off to Joe F. for his performance. Fantastic!

Aelfgyfu said...

I was amused to read your mention of product placement. Just the other day I wrote a blog entry on possibilities for product placement on Atlantis! I know you're busy, but if you have a few extra moments and want to read something totally frivolous, it's at
http://aelfgyfu-mead.livejournal.com/15490.html
I see possibilities for a novel approach to product placement. Atlantis could break new ground!

Best,
Aelfgyfu

Anonymous said...

It's been mentioned before but IMHO it bears mentioning again: I think it's totally unfair that only ratings in the US are taken into account by the powers that be.
Of course, I have no idea about how much money is actually made by selling the international rights to broadcast SGA but is it really that insignificant? The show is broadcast in very many countries (if Wikipedia is to be trusted) and the fans in other countries are just as loyal and worried/excited about a probable take-up of Season 5 than those in the oh-so-mighty US. It's a shame about the antiquated ratings system (thanks for explaining in detail!)

Anonymous said...

Hi again Mr.M

Worry not Re:ratings figures!! I think the DVR no.'s will give you a significant bounce, and rest assured we here in the Emerald Isle will continue to faithfully watch Atlantis!! Also, more pics of that hot girl Kelly McDowell please!!! Finally, with regard to advertising and subtle product placement, does this explain the new "leather look"?! I for one like it!!
Keep up the great blog, Mr M. ...and by the by...anymore from Cookie Monsters friend?

Shirt'n'Tie in Tipperary (It's a long way)

Anonymous said...

A kitten? In a household with three dogs? Well, I know it can be done - but I wouldn't want to try and get them all living together in harmony myself!! (Though the cat would no doubt rule the roost in the end, as cats always do! Poor dogs would end up at the bottom of the heirarchy!!)

Seriously, though, I love your blog and I absolutely loved Adrift - I'm very excited about Season 4 and don't care about the naysayers one jot. I intend to totally ignore them and make up my *own* mind by watching the season!

As far as I can tell, shows either change or stagnate, it's the way it goes. I prefer change to stagnation any day, even when it's painful - like losing Beckett, but then we wouldn't have Keller and she looks like an interesting character who I already like and am looking forward to getting to know more.

As for the ratings, I'm not qualified to say much on that. I'm not sure I like the idea of rolling ads at the bottom of the screen, but if that's they way to go then I'd put up with it. Just hope it's done in a way that isn't too invasive.

Leesa Perrie

Anonymous said...

Personally, living in the UK, I'm still waiting in eager anticipation of the start of the new season 4 of SGA on Oct 9th on Sky One.

I have to admit I'm interested to see how you've incorporated all the changes and holding judgement until I see it.

I would say that while I agree that TV generally needs to reassess how it calculates ratings and incorporates advertising, the viewership of a show will decrease if the stories - and more importantly, the characters - no longer interest people.

PLoker said...

Joe

I read your blog and I'm in total agreement with you.

I love my PVR (or dvr as you call it) and use it regularly but not for my "must see" show, like yours!! I doubt I have a neilson box but I think it's important to watch when it's airing. I hate commercials I wish I lived in a country that did not interupt my show to try and sell me crap I don't need! But thankfully I live in Canada we don't have Sci-fi channel and I watch each Monday commercial free on The Move network :)

Anywho I'm going out tommrow to get the books for this months book read!

Have a great day
Pen

Anonymous said...

bonjour/bonsoir

1)Vous sentez vous concernez sur d'éventuelle critique de stargate ?

2) Dans les livres on voit que les bouldogues, ronflent, rotent et pêtent ! en faites vous les frais avec Lulu ?

3) Pince mi et pince moi sont sur un bâteau ! pince mi tombe à l'eau il reste qui ?

4) vous allez répondre à mes questions ?

Bonne journée et agréable flatulance pour Lulu :)

Anonymous said...

Hi Joe,


I wouldn't worry about the anti's and the whingers. You can never please everyone. If some are not getting what they want from the show then why not just move on. Quit the griping and threatening to never watch again, though strangely enough most of them still seem to be watching. Those that just hang in there hoping the show will get cancelled just because they didn't get what they want are pretty pathetic. Though if we don't get a season 5 I'm sure most of these anti's will be celebrating. I guess that will make them feel better, who cares about all the folks that still love the show, and more importantly all the producers, crew and cast who will loose their jobs.

Adrift, Lifeline and Doppelganger were awesome and if the show continues like this season 4 will be the best season so far.

Fran said...

I as a new fan. Been one for 6 months 2 and 1/2 weeks now. I finally caught up with Season 3. So now I can join in everyone's conversations.

I love ths show no matter what changes are made. I really do not care much for hair. As long as Sheppard has that messy hair going on is a good day for me.

In my world a little change is good. You can't have the same thing going on all the time. Although I love the John and Rodney stories it is time to have stories for the rest of the group. Give them a chance to shine. And I am sure David and Joe are happy that one episode is not centered around them.

To be honest the same thing same stories make thing boring. I like to see things shaken up, etc. Makes the show more interesting.

Some of us folks have a choice. If you live in Canada and do not get TMN you either wait a year or two for the Space Channel to pick up Atlantis or if you cannot wait that long you go and Download it from the Net somewhere.

I love Stargate Atlantis it drives me bonkers that the SPACE CHANNEL here will start airing SEASON 4 next year. Or by the time when you can go to BEST BUY and buy the SEASON on DVD.

I wish Stargate Atlantis aired at the same time for everyone Worldwide because it is a popular show Worldwide. I know because I am getting my many Pen pals hooked on the show.

Sorry for the length of this comment.

Fran

Anonymous said...

Hi, I was wondering, at any point during season 4 are we going to see a massive F-302 battle with either the Wraith or the Asurans? I would love to see the craft being used more as a group rather than just a couple at a time.

Also, might we ever see a cloak installed on them or on the Daedalus, or indeed a shield on a 302? And one final question:

Will we see the Tria this season? Adrift will start season 4 here in the UK next Tuesday and I'm so looking forward to it. You guys and gals all rock at your jobs and I'm really thankful for bringing us such a good show.

Thanks

Fran said...

Hey Joe!
What are you naming your fish? Do not forget to feed them.

Living in Canada and having SPACE CHANNEL we here will not get to see SEASON 4 until it gets released to the general public. Or next year sometime. Come January 2008 they are airing Season 3.

How can we force SPACE CHANNEL not to do it this way and to air the show ealier instead of airing it after the fact when you can go and buy the DVD's?

It's stupid. Because come January who will watch it on SPACE because anyone that is a fan will be able to pop in the DVD and watch.

I wrote SPACE and told them that it is pointless airing SEASON 3 because we all have our copies and who will be watching it then and did not get any answer out of them.

So we are forced to Download the current Season. I am sorry but I cannot wait a year or two to see what happens. I watched "ADRIFT" on YOU TUBE and it was AWESOME. It is unfair that only a few fans get to see SGA whi;e the rest have to wait. But life is a bitch so what can you do?

Fran

Anonymous said...

Are you still optimistic for a 5th season pick-up, now that Adrift has aired? Is it possible that the fact that Adrift leaked before it aired hate an affect on the ratings?

Here’s hoping for a season 5, and many more!

Anonymous said...

What do you think are the chances of MGM doing Atlantis DVD movies if, the show isn’t picked-up for season 5?

Paula said...

Please let Kerry McDowell know that clearly it was worth the wait to see her picture. :)

Really keeping my fingers crossed that SciFi decides to lead the way with calculating the ratings. Their viewers are the leading edge of the new TV frontier and they need to be the ones to figure it out.

And, of course, keep SGA going and going and going!

Fran said...

Hey there Joe

I have to say I am a huge fan of John and Rodney and realize that it can't be The John and Rodney Show. I am looking forward to watching episodes surrounding the other characters and learning about them too.

Fran

Fran said...

Here's a few questions for you.

What are your plans now when there is the 4 month break?

What is the most challenging thing you've faced producing SGA?

What is a good day for you?

Fran

KIRK EASTMENT said...

Possible error in Adrift.

In the scene where Col. Carter and Dr. Lee are onboard the Midway Station and the Pegasus Stargate activates and Col. Ellis hails the Midway station....But how???....because in The Return Pt. 1 Rodnay McKay clearly states that once you enter the gate at say Atlantis the macro (that he wrote ) stores you in the buffer and sends you to the next gate and so on until you reach Midway so how could of Col. Ellis have a live conversation with Carter through an active stargate when the stargate on the panet Ellis was ringing from and Midway are too far away to connect a direct wormhole because thats why they have the bridge in the first place.

If you can answer this please tell me lol

Molly said...

Hi Joe,

I thought you might want to be aware of some of the issues involved in keeping goldfish. They're not really the pugs of the fish world--more like the Newfoundlands. They're basically carp in pretty colors, and can grow to enormous sizes; they "stay small" in bowls and small tanks only because they're stunted and die very, very young (they can live as long as thirty years). A pond is their ideal home, but they can winter in a large tub or aquarium, ideally 50+ gallons (obviously at this size, 10-20 gallons is an acceptable substitute if properly filtered--but they grow fast!).

They're your fish, and I understand if you want to say, "They're just fish," especially at this stressful point in your life, but I thought you'd want to know.

Thanks!

Caleb said...

Plus, with the episode mix-up over at iTunes, many people had issues getting their hands on episode 1. I know myself, this being the first time i've ever tried to buy a tv show off itunes, was very confused.

Hopefull those glitches will be worked out for episode 2!

Anonymous said...

Joe, I sure hope the show doesn't get cancelled, because I would feel a little bit guilty over it--my husband and I both work nights, and as a result we DVR'ed everything for the last few years. After a while we finally cancelled cable since we only watch Atlantis anyway, and started to buy it on I-tunes ($36 for a season pass is less than $60 for a month of satillite in a rural area). <---my confession...Hopefully the ratings people will get into the 21st century already, and see that things have changed.

Adrift was AWESOME, by the way, and we enjoyed Doppelganger too. I can't wait for Lifeline. woo hoo.

Kimberly

Anonymous said...

Hi Joe,

I'm a TIVO'er...and yes, I ff through the commercials. However, if the lead out commercial is creative, we will sit and watch it. And for creative commercials, we've been known to stop and watch over and over again. So, in an advertising respect - I'm sure House could burn off some cancerous leg with a Coke in product placement, however, if Ad execs actually do their jobs, they'll retain their audience so to speak. As a TIVOer I will also stop for the 2 min BSG things in the middle of the breaks...so really - inserting ads has become in a sense like producing a mini show...

Dang advertisers never are with the times when you want them to be...radio has also gone through the audience loss due to internet and iPod...but it's easier for shows to syndicate content for alot less money and they can insert advertisers pretty easily there...but radio is a mess also, this is why we no longer work in it...

But, I'm rambling... Love your blog...thanks for doing it!

S

Anonymous said...

Joe, back in September on the 13th, you said "Also, to all those who don’t know yet - SciFi Channel will be broadcasting season 4 in HD!" Can I get more information on that? I really want to watch in HD, but I can't find out where to tune in or what carrier I have to subscribe to in order to watch. Thanks.

Jeremy DC said...

Hi Joe,

Speaking of House, have you tuned in to the fourth season? I'm very happy to see Carmen Argenziano again, I have to say I missed him since his character died back in season 8. And he's recurring, too (Man, do I love that show...)

As for the ratings—meeh, I don't really care for now, I guess I'll wait for the definitive numbers. But things have changed so drastically I don't even know what good ratings are anymore. I'm glad you still feel positive for the show. (As do I.)

Greetings from France !

Teknikal said...

bam bam- joes Hair double!!!

any replies from your email scamming faithful??????

Francy said...

Hi Joe! First time commenting, I'm not a regular reader of your blog 'cause I want to sit down one day and read all the "previous episodes"! :-P

The Nielsen's ratings are stupid, but they ARE trying to improve... go here to rate Atlantis:
http://www.heynielsen.com/view/stargate-atlantis/
(Everybody, GO!) Atlantis is the first show right now, WAY ahead of the others!!

Ivana said...

I really hope that Atlantis gets a 5th season pick up. It would be great and I'll watch it no matter what you guys change, I just love the show.
I still have faith..

Greetings from Vienna...

Anonymous said...

Joe, I love the show and will most definitely continue to watch. I fell in love with Stargate because it took me places I can never go and in a way I had never experienced before.

To the fans who have been wounded by the nixing of their favorite characters: I feel your pain. You deserve a period of mourning. Many of you are in the anger stage. Then there comes a time to move on, right? It's unhealthy to hold on to nasty, negative feelings. And it's no fun. This show is meant to be fun. And yes, it's true...it belongs to another...others, really...who will mold it and shape it as they see fit. We may not like every change, but we can accept those decisions as someone's personal, creative license, yes? It's a great show, providing great entertainment. Peace, Stargate fans.

Anonymous said...

Well, I don't pretend to understand how the bigwigs analyse and make decisions based on ratings. I know I'd renew SGA for a 5th season based on what I've seen so far. Pity I'm not in a position to do that.

Season 4 does look incredibly good from what I've seen. I'm really excited about the new season, and can't wait to see Adrift in 40 inches of HD next Tuesday on Sky One. I think I may not be conscious when I watch DG though!

The best of luck with the ratings for Lifeline. I was stunned, and not in a good way, at the Adrift ratings. Life isn't fair sometimes. I hope SciFi has the sense to see through these ratings and realise the potential the show has. My fingers are still crossed for a season 5. :)

Maat said...

I havn't commented on your blog before, but I do love reading it. It is very nice of you to interact with fans in this way!

I now feel like commenting every time the DVR/ratings issue comes up. Thank you for saying that this is the way the world is, and it is not going to change. Media use changes, so how we pay for it will change too. (Because apperently the $75 I pay to Comcast each month is not enough to get good programming).

While the set repaint is the *real* reason I didn't watch the show live on Friday but waited until Monday, I rarely watch shows live anymore. Why should I? I don't have time to let my life revolve around TV schedules, and I think this is the real reason for the DVRs, not just ability to skip ads.

In addition I see the commercials already changing. Some companies does not get it, but some does. I notices that car companies especially have their 'tag line' on the screen long enough to read even when fast forwarding. I might not hear the the exact words, but it is still what makes a Subaru, a Subaru.
I hope that the advertising companies can see the writing on the wall, and realise that even with fast forward, they can get retun on the ads.

Or maybe we can all live in a brave new world one day where I don't have to subscribe to cable, but I can pay directly for the episodes I want to watch, and for nothing else....

Anonymous said...

I've been drawn into making my first comment, and I have to second smb_books' comment having been slightly offended by some of your comments.

Whilst the changes made to casting will obviously not be the only factor in affecting the show’s viewing figures, to say they have no effect is equally ridiculous. I fell in love with the show and characters in episode 1, and since recent events I have discovered that I am no longer bothered whether I see an episode or not. I don’t think the departure of well-loved characters or change in focus of the show can really be comparable to change in set colour (although nice new uniforms this season ;P).

That isn’t to say I don’t still enjoy it, or that I don’t want a season 5 – I do, for reasons shared by a lot of people previously. So good luck with the figures, but and I hope they lead to the outcome all the fans want.

Anonymous said...

Wow, big response today Joe. Just so you know us Europeans can't get enough of the show. So when it goes balls up in the US just keep sending 'em here lol

Anonymous said...

Will the Seer reveal any prophecies or portents of things to come?

Anonymous said...

Bonsoir Joe (et oui à l'heure où je poste, il fait déjà nuit chez moi! en plus on est chanceux on est en alerte orange pour les orage, vive les inondations annuelles!)

Voilà vu que vous aimez beaucoup les plats, je voulais savoir si vous aviez déjà goûté à la gardiane de taureaux accompagné de riz Camarguais?

-Vu que c'est le thème de ma région se soir, avez-vous déjà assisté à une inondation? (ne serait-ce pas une bonne idée à inclure dans un épisode?)

Merci, bonne journée (ben oui il fait jour chez vous encore!)

Anonymous said...

So, assuming "the Last Man" deals with time travel and not McKay getting life sucked by a wraith, is there a possibility of scenes with both the younger and older McKays together?

Anonymous said...

Dear Joe,

You put a very good commentary today, I totally agree with you. As my English is not good, I'd say that I share the commentaries by XATHRAS, KEIRBERDS and S'CLAIREf99.
I hate to be forced to watch commercials because 90% are boring and made for persons with an IQ of less than 10. It is the reason why we register all the shows we are watching on TV.Soon we will register the News because there is commercial now during it even on CBC the public broadcast!!
But if the commercials were creative and as good as a Stargate ep, it could be aired all together at the end of an episode and maybe we would like to watch it an other time on the dvd provided that we always have the choice to skip it at will.

Anonymous said...

I'm sure this has already been thought of, and maybe it's too expensive...but can't the show be promoted on ABC, CBS, NBC and the CW? Even during the day or weekends. (If I've missed those promos, my mistake.) It'd reach the audience that flocks to the shows on those stations and rarely ventures out to other areas of their own accord. Even if many still do not have cable, seeing an intriguing promo for Atlantis might motivate a few thousand to buy the DVD set(s) and then maybe get cable to pick up watching the show.

Anonymous said...

Hey Joe,

I have to agree with you re: the boycotting fans. I find it sad that some - not all - of these fans are willing to bad mouth and actively turn people against something they loved so much just on the basis of a controversial storyline.

Having being one of the lucky (or unlucky, depending on how you view it in the spoilers arena) people who have seen both Adrift and Doppelganger, I can't help but feel for those who wont see how much stronger and tighter the writing and acting has gotten for the new season.

In the worst case scenario of the show not getting a pick up for S5, they'll be left with only Season 4 to get round to when they finally calm down and realise that they've contributed in a small way to the discontinuation of possibly the most interesting and culturally diverse Sci-Fi show that's ever been produced.

The ratings system is a joke when cross-platform media took off years ago but, as always, it's always those higher up that are the last to get with the times and people lose out.

Regardless of what happens, I'd just like to say that so far, Season 4 proves that everyone involved in the show has gone above and beyond to make sure that this is by far the best season that could be produced - and for that, you should all be proud and accept the thanks and gratitude of those fans who put aside their own selfish character ideals and realise just how much this means to you guys too.

All your work? Is definitely worth it and appreciated!

Anonymous said...

Mmm...so, I am ignorant because having considered the changes you have made to your show I no longer want to watch it....and yes it is because of the changes to the show you have made. There is no animosity, I and the majority of other former viewers of the show do not want the show cancelled, just because I have been disappointed doesn't mean I want others to be. I understand you must be disappointed Joe, I really do, (and whatever you say this is not a good result) but attacking people because they no longer like what you are producing? How exactly are you (the well paid professional I would imagine) better than a minority of unpleasent indiviuals posting on Gateworld? Yes there are a small minority who have determined that they will hate it no matter what you do now (just as there are those who will love it no matter what you do- are they ignorant for slavishly following what you do?) but they are a minority, you see it every day, the same names pop up again and again. You condemn all those who you have disappointed because they no longer want to watch your show and in doing so I think you reveal a little more about what you really think about the future of the show. In the past I have wished you and the show well and I still do, I have no reason to wish it to fail, but calling me ignorant won't make me watch again. Making Stargate Atlantis a good show again will.

Anonymous said...

Salut joseph!! =D

J'ai pas trop le temp aujourd'hui^^!!

Merci pour les photo et d'avoir plus parler des audiences!!

Ma question:
Il faudrais que les audiences de la saison 4 soient a combient pour qu'il y'est une saison 5?

Voila ,voila, Merci bc!!! je vous aime! vous êtes génial!! a demain!! Gros bisouuu!!

Unknown said...

*waves*

For the next few minutes i'm going to talk seriously. I know it may come as a shock, but I can do serious on occasions, when i'm feeling incredibly boring. :D

I was reading a blog, not so long ago from a writer on another high profilish show. (Sorry can't remember who it was *kicks fried brain*) And he mentioned in the blog that as writers during the series, he and members of the writing staff, liked to take an idea and experiment with stories, effects, plot lines etc and 'test' fan reactions to see if it went down well. Sometimes he said it worked, other times, not so much, but he wanted fans to understand that they needed that 'leeway in creativity' to try out new things. Do you and the other writers ascribe to that philosophy?

Too many long hours in work has turned me into a boring individual. *sigh* I definately need a bit of fluff to lighten the moment.

Thanks for the pics and since I am being boring, I thought i'd finish with my comments on anti's. To be perfectly honest. I really don't see the point on wasting my precious time and effort on something I can't stand anymore, I really don't. I can appreciate the wait and see brigade, but the downright 'i''m miserable, so i'm going to make sure everyone else is' mentality. I don't get it. How can you possibly despise something you haven't seen? For me it falls out of the realms of logic...

Ayway i'm off before the tomatoe throwing begins. And to end on a positive note, we'll get a S5! Of that i've no doubt.

*hugs*

Anonymous said...

After thinking about it, and looking at the pics you posted up, I've got a guess about The Last Man.
Would it happen to be related in anyway to SG1 1x19, There But For the Grace of God?
Because I don't see any other way that Shep and Old Mckay could be in the same scene, trapped in a hallway.
thanks.

Anonymous said...

"I feel like Martin Lloyd..."No, really!" It's no coincidence that you guys were getting your highest ratings during seasons seven and eight, the years where that awful, horrible, verboten Sam/Jack ship was a serious story arc for the show. And it's no coincidence that the ratings took a nose dive when it became apparent that it wouldn't be part of the show anymore and that you weren't going to resolve it. I don't understand your (TPTB's) general reluctance towards and fear of this plotline. It bumps ratings, plain and simple. You've got the figures, you know it already"

#1. This is Atlantis, not Sg-1 season 11.

#2. Having the star of the show leave couldn't have affected the ratings at all. No really.

Anonymous said...

Cara said...
Mmm...so, I am ignorant because having considered the changes you have made to your show I no longer want to watch it....and yes it is because of the changes to the show you have made.


If I may be so bold.. I think you've rather misinterpreted what Joe's post said... it didn't say people were ignorant for choosing not to watch the show because of the changes.. it said people were ignorant for claiming that the comparitive drop in ratings is entirely attributable to whatever change they don't like and that factual evidence about things like DVR usage is "an excuse" used by TPTB.

And I rather fear on that point he's probably right... given that Joe has worked in the TV industry for many years and is intimately familiar with ratings and how all that stuff works, for fans of the show who, with all due respect, have nowhere near his level of industry knowledge, to make bold claims about how they know better than he does about these things.. is displaying ignorance.

Dreams-of-Skies said...

Whilst I don't really understand the ratings game and I can't help with boosting them anyways (what with being in the UK and not having Sky and not being able to iTunes download), thanks for explaining it, Joe.

I see that the anti's are still out in force. *sigh* I have to agree with Lil Devil - if I don't like something anymore, I stop watching. For me though, I never stopped loving Stargate (admittedly I'm a Farscape fan too so I loved the idea of seeing Ben and Claudia again - for my sins) and unless you guys seriously bomb it, I'll always love Stargate.

Just promise me you'll never bomb it, Joe...or I will track you all down one by one and....uhm....pour lemon juice on your papercuts! A-ha! *giggle*

Personal opinion (not endorsed or condoned by anyone but me): Adrift ROCKED! I loved every second and there have been some great set-ups planted all ready for future episodes - on edge of seat waiting to see more, Joe, really I am!

Is there the same sense and depth of family among the ranks of Atlantians as there is with the SG1ers? When I see the behind the scenes stuff, it certainly seems like they all have a ball!

Hope your head has now completely recovered!

Dreams

Anonymous said...

savez vous que beaucoup de fan ont décidé de ne plus regarder Stargate Atlantis depuis que weir et carson ne sont plus dedans. Pensez vous avoir fait un bon choix en les faisant partir??

Anonymous said...

if the show is stopped, can you propose it on another channels??

Anonymous said...

Cool goldfish. Have you named them? If not can I name them Sparky and Spanky?

Anonymous said...

On the topic of distribution and control in the internet age, you migh be interested in this... YAHOO VICE PRESIDENT TELLS MUSIC INDUSTRY TO SHAPE UP